Lookinf for scanner

[Tundra555]

I am new to this stuff i alway's i recently heard a shop guard speaking on radio near me and found it interesting, i want to get scanner to know what they are talking about. I am looking for cheapest digital scanner that will allow me to listen to private guard services and even better police and firefighters too.
But i dont have alot of money for it, i just need cheapest digital option that is attachable to the PC, could you estimate cost and probably give me some advice on what i can get in Europe (we don't have much here)?

[csnyder1]

Well, I would tell you to try to find out what model radio they are using.  If you can get a good look at one in use note the brand and get a good mental picture of it and do some google searching and you'll find what freqs. they operate on.  Most mall securities use pretty basic two-way radios which most basic (non-digital) scanners will pick up.  I would suggest looking on eBay for a cheap one ($50-100 USD, used is fine) that has receive capabilities of 30-1000mhz.  Hope that helps.

[Tundra555]

Well, I would tell you to try to find out what model radio they are using.  If you can get a good look at one in use note the brand and get a good mental picture of it and do some google searching and you'll find what freqs. they operate on.  Most mall securities use pretty basic two-way radios which most basic (non-digital) scanners will pick up.  I would suggest looking on eBay for a cheap one ($50-100 USD, used is fine) that has receive capabilities of 30-1000mhz.  Hope that helps.

I am in Europe, cant use eBay or radio shack, i want digital to use computer software to scan i heard its pain in the ass to program scanner manually.

Thats the unit, any idea what it is?

[immabadspellor_]

That radio is an Icom IC-F3S.  It has the same body style as the IC-F4S and the IC-A4, but the A4 is for aviation and judging by what you've said, I doubt they're using aircraft frequencies.  It's definitely not an F4S as they're UHF and that antenna is too long to be UHF so it's definitely a VHF radio.  That's how I came to the conclusion that it's an F3S.

These radios operate on 136-174MHz.  They're analog, capable of trunking (with optional board), CTCSS and DCS.  Unless they're on a trunking system (highly unlikely IMO), you could pick these up with pretty much ANY scanner, even a 20 year old 10 channel piece of crap.  What do you want to do with a computer interface?

[Tundra555]

Great, thanks.

These radios operate on 136-174MHz.  They're analog, capable of trunking (with optional board), CTCSS and DCS.  Unless they're on a trunking system (highly unlikely IMO), you could pick these up with pretty much ANY scanner, even a 20 year old 10 channel piece of crap.

I found some info saying two systems are used SmarTrunk II and EDACS so probably they use trunking whatever this is, i'll try to get more detail info.

What do you want to do with a computer interface?

i were thinking to record for later listening isn't there is there any other advantages of using PC software for scanning?

[immabadspellor_]

I found some info saying two systems are used SmarTrunk II and EDACS so probably they use trunking whatever this is, i'll try to get more detail info.

Is the info you found about the IC-F3S or about the shop guard's radio system?  If you're referring to the radio, it is capable of trunking with an optional board, but by default they aren't trunking radios.  I wouldn't think that a security firm would need a trunking system but I could be wrong.  If they are in fact using trunking, it's best to have a trunk tracking scanner.  If they're on a trunked system then they're using more than one frequency and the transmissions can jump between frequencies.  In practice, analog trunked systems don't jump frequencies that often and you can usually set all of the frequencies in a trunk into memory and just scan all of them locking out the control channel. 

What do you want to do with a computer interface?

i were thinking to record for later listening isn't there is there any other advantages of using PC software for scanning?

If you just want to record, you don't need a scanner with a computer interface.  Just use a 1/8" male mono to 1/8" male stereo patch cable.  Download some vox recording freeware and that'll do what you need.  You could really do this on the cheap!

[Tundra555]

Still trying to find out whatever they use trunking or not.
Meanwhile, we don't have much choice of scanners here, and one that available are overpriced.
Cheapest is Alinco DJ-X3 which looks like baby radio.
Also Alinco DJ-X7, review sucks, think first one works even worse.
Another choice is Icom IC-R5 which is overpriced also (IC-R9500, IC-R1500, IC-R2500, IC-PCR1500, IC-PCR2500) not sure what this is.
Thats pretty much all i found in my price range, think i going to have to order from overseas, can someone advice good scanner with transmitter function under 200-250$?

[csnyder1]

Well, many two-way radios are scanners to a certain degree.  However, those radios usually only scan on the bands that they transmit on.  You're gonna probably want a ham radio of some sort that covers 140-170mhz or 430-470mhz.  If the security radios you are wanting to listen to are on 800mhz or 900mhz then you're probably gonna have a difficult time transmitting on those frequencies because radios that do that aren't readily available to the public and if you do find one (Motorola Maxtrac for example) they have to be programmed specially by a service center who has the programming software.. but the internet is a vast resource so I'm sure there are ways around it!  Anyways, look into the Yaesu vx-7r.  Easily modifiable radio, but it won't transmit on the 800/900mhz bands.  You can find those used for around $200. 

[immabadspellor_]

can someone advice good scanner with transmitter function under 200-250$?

I wasn't aware you were looking for a transceiver until just now.  If you're on a budget and can determine that they're not using trunking and only CTCSS, you can pick up a cheap Chinese HT like the Jingtong JT-208.  Exporters are selling them on eBay from Hong Kong for about $40 brand new shipping included.  That'll cover the same frequencies as that Icom IC-F3S will.  If your only desire is to have a transceiver capable of CTCSS and 136-174MHz operation only, it's hard to beat that deal.  A lot of people who are looking to just screw around are blowing $300 on a quad band HT.  If you have no use for the real purpose of the VX-7R, I don't know why you'd waste that much money on getting that particular radio when you can get what you want to do done for a lot cheaper.  There are more HT's in the world than the VX-7R although I'm sure Yaesu/Vertex Standard doesn't mind making some extra bucks!

[Tundra555]

Easily modifiable radio, but it won't transmit on the 800/900mhz bands. 

No one here use 800/900MHz bands AFAIK, anyway i don't need radio that can transmit there, it should transmit at least at some standard bands 140-174MHz would be enough for me.

I wasn't aware you were looking for a transceiver until just now.  If you're on a budget and can determine that they're not using trunking and only CTCSS, you can pick up a cheap Chinese HT like the Jingtong JT-208.

I want more coverage than just simply a transmitter can offer i like to listen as much as possible including airplane bands etc. I found out that used ranges are 27MHz FM/AM, 1-88MHz, 140-174 MHz, 400-500MHz.
So want more scanner that can scan wide range, but can transmit as well to certain point (just in case), and being small is optional. I would've bought as Icom IC-Q7A which they discontinued and did not replace with anything else AFAIK. Although i can still gert new IC-Q7A for 250$+ 50-60$ for shipping from overseas it will cost me like new IC-R5 bought locally....
Both can be open to scan 0.5-2000MHz instead of default 30–1309Mhz, btw is it worth getting one that can scan 1309-2000MHz is there much going on at this bands?

A lot of people who are looking to just screw around are blowing $300 on a quad band HT.  If you have no use for the real purpose of the VX-7R, I don't know why you'd waste that much money on getting that particular radio when you can get what you want to do done for a lot cheaper.

I don't really know anything about radios, whats the advantage of quad band?


Edit: Most gov agencies using coded EDACS right now, do i need some special scanner to listen em?
Turns out they going to switch to Trans European Trunked RAdio (TETRA), next year will it be possible to listen to them when they do switch to TETRA?

[immabadspellor_]

e]
I want more coverage than just simply a transmitter can offer i like to listen as much as possible including airplane bands etc. I found out that used ranges are 27MHz FM/AM, 1-88MHz, 140-174 MHz, 400-500MHz.
So want more scanner that can scan wide range, but can transmit as well to certain point (just in case), and being small is optional. I would've bought as Icom IC-Q7A which they discontinued and did not replace with anything else AFAIK. Although i can still gert new IC-Q7A for 250$+ 50-60$ for shipping from overseas it will cost me like new IC-R5 bought locally....
Both can be open to scan 0.5-2000MHz instead of default 30–1309Mhz, btw is it worth getting one that can scan 1309-2000MHz is there much going on at this bands?

I think you would be best served by getting a cheap transceiver AND a scanner for a couple reasons.  First, it seems like you're more interested in the features of a scanner.  While ham radios do have scan capabilites, most scan slowly compared to a real scanner.  The real deal breaker is that there aren't ANY ham radios which are trunk trackers, let alone can decode any of the commercial digital systems out there.  As for 1309-2000, don't bother.  I don't hear much of anything here in that range.  It's mostly digital crap, telemetry, satellite stuff, and although there are some land mobile allocations in there I'm not aware of any manufacturers who make your typical 2-way analog voice radios for those frequencies.  Now that's here in North America, maybe it's different in Europe, but I doubt it.  Even so, I highly doubt that scanner's sensitivity is all that great in that frequency range.  You'd likely have to be right next to the transmitter to hear anything.  That's what I find anyway with scanners that'll pick up 2400MHz out of the box.  The .5-30 band is interesting, shortwave and AM broadcast but unless you have a LONG antenna to hook it up to, it's not going to matter much. 

e]
I don't really know anything about radios, whats the advantage of quad band?

Quad band means that it operates as a tranceiver on four bands.  In the case of the VX-7R, those bands are 6 meters (50-54MHz), 2 meters (144-148MHz), 1.25 meters (222-225MHz at reduced power), and 70cm (420-450MHz).  Of course after modifications these limits are stretched a bit but those are the ranges the radio is designed to transmit in.  Note that even though the modifications will allow transmissions outside of the ham bands that the actual transmitted power will be less than advertised the further you get away from these bands due to the radio's circuitry being tuned for the ham bands and the antenna that it comes with being tuned for the ham bands as well resulting in high SWR the further you go outside those bands.  If you're only looking to transmit between 136 and 174, getting a radio that transmits on 3 other bands as well is a bit overkill.  They don't toss those bands in for free! 

e]
Edit: Most gov agencies using coded EDACS right now, do i need some special scanner to listen em?
Turns out they going to switch to Trans European Trunked RAdio (TETRA), next year will it be possible to listen to them when they do switch to TETRA?

You'll need a scanner capable of doing EDACS like the Uniden TrunkTracker III.  That'll work provided they aren't encrypted.  Scanners don't transmit thus you'll need a cheap transceiver if you need that capability.  As for TETRA, there aren't any scanners that can do it.  There is some bench test equipment that can, but it'll run you about $60,000. 

[Tundra555]

You'll need a scanner capable of doing EDACS like the Uniden TrunkTracker III.  That'll work provided they aren't encrypted.

They are by AEGIS Digital Voice seems like dead end? I heard prog called UniTrunker can decode sometimes, can someone confirm?

[immabadspellor_]

You'll need a scanner capable of doing EDACS like the Uniden TrunkTracker III.  That'll work provided they aren't encrypted.

They are by AEGIS Digital Voice seems like dead end? I heard prog called UniTrunker can decode sometimes, can someone confirm?

That's a bummer.  Here's what RadioReference.com has to say about AEGIS:

MA/Com Ericsson EDACS AEGIS
This is MA/Com / Ericsson's implementation of IMBE Digital modulation.  Very few agencies today are using AEGIS Digital Voice solutions, since they are 1st generation digital voice solutions and considered dated.

EDACS AEGIS systems use the MA/Com / GE EDACS Control Channel.

There is not a scanner available today that can monitor EDACS AEGIS Digital voice.   

Now this isn't the end of the world.  You could buy an Ericsson radio capable of AEGIS.  How would you scan, you ask?  Take a regular scanner, tap the IF @ 10.7MHz, use a signal generator to generate a frequency to mix with the IF frequency whose result is a frequency the Ericsson radio can receive.  For example, if the Ericsson radio can tune 460MHz, use a 470.7MHz signal generator.  Mixed with the IF output of the scanner will result in a 460MHz signal.  Now whatever your scanner tunes will be fed into the Ericsson AEGIS capable radio and will be decoded.....provided it's not encrypted!

I'm not sure if Unitrunker will do AEGIS.  I don't know anyone around here that uses it to try it on.